At a special Council meeting on Thursday October 10, Mayor Lucas Cleveland will give a “Notice of Motion” that asks the Cobourg Police Board to “explore the possibility of a merger with the Port Hope Police Services while continuing to explore all opportunities for expansion including but not limited to provision of police services into Hamilton township”. In the motion, Lucas provides the rationale where he explains that small to medium sized Police forces need to “expand, merge or be taken over by the OPP”. However, he makes it clear that the OPP option is NOT to be considered nor is the idea of a County wide Police Service. His motion and reasoning follow up on a recent County Study which pointed to cost reductions possible – in addition Lucas adds some comments on how the service could be improved if it were larger.
But let’s look at the reasoning.
Why not OPP or County wide Police?
In the notice of Motion, Lucas states:
This council without reservation fully supports and endorses the work, integrity, professionalism of the Cobourg Police Service (CPS). The CPS Board and the Leadership of the CPS state unequivocally that there is no interest from this council in looking to the Ontario Provincial Police (OPP) to provide Policing services within the town of Cobourg.
And
It is known that a local police service provides a more community specific approach to policing and can use a ‘tiered’ approach that utilizes auxiliary and special constables to reduce costs and offset officer shortages.
And
It is known that the OPP continues to have difficulty recruiting front line officers which resulted in a recent pay increase making them the highest paid constables in the province; and
Why Expand?
An expanded and/or combined force would allow for the creation of specialized units required to effectively solve many of the current issues plaguing our community including a Drug unit, K9, Intelligence, Sex assault/intimate partner violence, victim services, and/or forensics.
And
It has been documented and accepted that all Ontario small to medium sized police services need to either look to mergers or Section 14 agreements [that is, take over nearby Policing – e.g. Hamilton] to meet the growing community demands, provincial regulations and increasing costs of high quality, community-based policing in 2024 under the newest Community Safety and Policing Act, 2019 [a link to this Provincial Legislation is in Resources].
What direction has Council given to date?
This council already passed a motion on April 24, 2024 stating clearly that “Council request the Cobourg Police Service Board look at the opportunities to them for the expansion of policing within Northumberland County” and resolution 047-23 that clearly states “the town of Cobourg does not support any further study on County-wide policing within this term of council.”
Action proposed by Lucas
Cobourg Council recommends that the Cobourg Police Service Board begin to explore the possibility of a merger with the Port Hope Police Services while continuing to explore all opportunities for expansion including but not limited to provision of police services into Hamilton township; and
Further that Cobourg Council recommend that Mayor Lucas Cleveland write to Mayor Hankivsky of Port Hope and the Council of Port Hope along with Mayor Scott Jibb of Hamilton Township and the Council of Hamilton township to inform them of this direction and ask that they consider these options and possibilities as councils.
It remains to be seen if the rest of Council will support this move but it seems to be what the Province is pointing to with its 2019 update of the Police Act. Further, a merger of Cobourg Police with Port Hope Police would seem not to have the problems that Chief VandeGraaf was objecting to when the subject came up at the County. It will be interesting to see who on the Cobourg Police Board would be assigned to “explore all opportunities”.
Resources
- Community Safety and Policing Act, 2019 – Ontario Legislation
- General Information on Cobourg Police including about the Police Board
- More on County Policing Report – 18 September 2024
- The Notice of Motion is on the Agenda of the 10 October Special Council Meeting – go here.
Note: The Special Council meeting on 10 October has two items – the first is in closed session and the second is per the above. Although the second item is public, I believe that no delegations are allowed for a notice of motion.
Update – 6:10 pm on October 10
After making clear that the motion simply ALLOWED the Police Board to look at the possibility of a merger, Council approved the motion. Councillor Bureau said that it would be the first of many steps including extensive public consultation. But along the way, Councillor Mutton clashed with Mayor Cleveland, it got personal – she was the single vote against the motion.
Go to escribe at 1:24:53 to see 40 minutes of discussion. Link here.
Print Article:
I noted in the video of the council meeting that the mayor referenced that Owen Sound and West Grey were pursuing amalgamation and were further ahead than Cobourg and Port Hope.
So curious I decided to research and came across this article
https://www.bayshorebroadcasting.ca/2024/09/05/owen-sound-mayor-intends-to-bring-motion-to-pursue-police-partnership-discussions-with-west-grey/
It appears that they are only about 8 weeks ahead of Cobourg and only want to explore whether it will be an amalgamation or just a sharing of executive leadership and some other items like recruiting etc.
To me listening to the Mayor it sounded it like Owen Sound and West grey were amalgamating when in fact they they re wanting to have a discussion on whether to amalgamate or share certain things
I suggest all take a read.
Today’s arrest announcement was on my street just a few doors away. It was signalled to CPS in August by my vigilant neighbor and came to a conclusion in 2 months. We’ve learned our lesson from Battell. Never again as long as we stand together. My spouse has 4-6 toddlers she cares for who she walks to the local park every day right near where armed drug dealers operated. Politics and funding aside, I’m grateful the cops go to work every day. Thank you for doing your jobs! I can appreciate the importance of long term planning on structural issues regarding policing and the large amounts of money being discussed. Given the situation with 310 and the sale of Brookside (end of Oct is what I’m hearing), I expect this won’t be the last we’ll be debating police costs. I fail to understand why an emergency meeting was called for this issue, but it was. We can talk about the next 3 years if you like, I’m much more concerned about the next 3 weeks. As for the proposal, let’s not forget the County report has gaps as CPS refused to cooperate. Asking where the other parties are positioned on the issue makes sense. Getting there is a very long road. I hope the CPS has a better plan then County regarding the eviction. I’m sure it can’t be worse.
I sincerely doubt the encampment inhabitants will be evicted even after the sale goes through. CPS will find some excuse not to attend I reckon.
If the sale is eminent, where is the dispersal plan? Who will be involved in the removal? By-Law? CPS? OPP? County? What if there is resistance? Council and Mayor are silent.
We need to first and foremost cut the CPS budget. With over 50% of our tax dollars going to protection services, it makes sense to cut CPS funding.
Many will say that we have no choice but to accept what is presented, but we do have a choice. Any we need to exercise it.
And we, through Council, need to opt for the best service for the least cost.
If the Ontario Provincial Police can provide that, let’s do it.
As a minimum the OPP need to be considered at the same that the merger concept is being explored.
Request an OPP proposal so the costs savings or otherwise are known. By not doing this the Mayor and Council, IMO, are negligent in carry out their responsibilities.
If they do not include the OPP for consideration, then each needs to express why not. The constituents deserve confirmation that personal preferences are not coming into play
Fantastic suggestion But will it happen ? not that you have raised the question
Probably not ! But Certainly a very Valid point
The other problem this town council has is very limited
financial background amongst them and with a newer bean counter in the Accounting and Tax Dept who is able to offer alternatives instead of just spending more money
Sandpiper,
You wrote “a newer bean counter in the Accounting and Tax Dept”. I think this demeaning comment is unworthy of you..
I have had discussions with the “new” finance director about the state of the Town’s finances and the department’s “products”. I have found him receptive to alternatives and suggestions.
For example, he recommended to Council (approved) that IT be added to the scope of the audit committee and the committee include two citizen “experts” These changes would have been unlikely previously.
The challenge he faces is the inertia of a legacy culture. Productive cooperative change takes time to install. The brute force approach (Bob Sanderson newly elected Port Hope mayor) also works but is considerably riskier.
Part of the bigger issue has always been the board and previous Councils giving the rubber stamp to the budget as it has been presented, without a lot of push back or questions to support what they want. Municipal staff will always ask for the moon and if they are not challenged and council accepts then its a win!! What they want and what they actually need are very different!
Eastender,
While agreeing with your general point, it is important to get the numbers correct so that the argument’s credibility is not compromised by inaccurate data and exaggeration.
For 2024 the following are the budgeted taxpayer funded costs:
Total Levy $31M
Police $7.4M 23.9%
Fire & other $5.8M 18.7%
Total Protection $13.2M 42.6%
Note that the $7.4M police cost is net of about $2M in funding from the crimcheck business
Thank you for tempering my hyperbole, nevertheless, do we really need to spend our tax dollars the tune of $7.4mio. Not a very good return on investment. CPS does not need electric vehicles, batten-burgh designs, a shooting range, etc.
I agree. I don’t know where our Mayor gets to decide what the people of Cobourg want. With the police force up in the air. I would like to know why the police board signed on the chief for another 5 years. Looks like they have made their mind up for us as well.
As a political leader not sure how you can not look at an amalgamated/merger of police service. Three police services for a population of approx. 45k (Cobourg, Port Hope, Hamilton) or 80k for the whole county does seem to make sense??
As we all know this subject seems to comes up every term of council however there is never the political will to get it done. I hope that Cobourg Council take this seriously, take into account the needs/wishes of the constituency and more importantly how we can provide a more efficient/ effective public service. I understand this may also have the support of the province.
Council need to take control of this issue and remember who the employer is and who ultimately should be making the very important decision for best interest of the community. Police service boards and police senior management team do not run this municipality the Mayor and Council do!!!!
I think we have all heard this before especially if you have lived her for more than 20 yrs .
The question is not how serious everyone is making these statements but rather or who runs Council & the Town but rather who Runs and Directs the Police Dept and who actually listens to that direction ,
And what is More Economically Viable and better equipped now and in the Long run for the Benefits Residents .
If these Cobourg officers are Qualified I am sure the OPP is looking to Hire.
Good points sandpiper! Most police services in the country are looking to hire good qualified recruits and experienced officers, plenty of opportunities out there for those who choose this very admirable career path!
We need the subject matter expertise of the police management team, frontline officers and the board to advise on specifics BUT they don’t make the decisions on who provides the service! The Chief does not speak on behave of the constituency or the Town of Cobourg when he addresses County or Town Council he speaks on behave of the police service and hopefully that is aligned within Councils wishes…..and if they are not aligned then maybe other police services can use qualified people!
I support the Mayor making this motion to council and only hope Council ultimately make the decision that best serves the community.
Mark I do not have a problem with the Mayor wanting to
Motivate the Police Dept or Change our Policing system .
We all know its needed, and as many here have stated what happens when the eviction from Brookside takes place ???
The streets & Residents of Cobourg have never experienced these issues before . Safety and security of our Homes and Families is the utmost concern to all . The issue at hand is we only have a few weeks left before these unsheltered hit the streets again.
Neither the County or the Police Dept seem equipped to discuss or reveal an Action plan . 310 will not be the solution and with the County Housing Services Manager Quitting recently with out explanation leaves us all feeling less than Secure .
And again the Budget on 310 is soaring as fast as the mega million over runs that the New Golden Plough is experiencing
all at the Tax Payers .
In days gone by our Police force had a lot of Old Boys on it that lived and raised their families here . They took pride in their jobs and Community matters like this were sorted ,out and
the Courts dealt with repeat offenders, we had a Cobourg Jail
there was no Catch and release program . May be these offenders should just be left at the County Court offices for them to handle and police on their own
The Police station did not close at 5 or 6 pm . We had our own Dispatch with officers on duty
These are issues that should have been discussed and dealt with By Council before the renewal of any Police or Management contracts were renewed .
Where is the Logic in all this after thought ??????
Sometimes the best setting is the DEFAULT setting.
Change always comes at a cost, and guess who pays, YOU the taxpayer.
It seems this mayor, and all of council for that matter is just trying to justify its existence.
But of course, all bureaucrats are the same; they use their citizens as pawns to pay for their projects…
OLD BOYS Club with in .
So, you believe the DEFAULT is working? Really? Have you walked the streets of Cibourg recently?
This situation is crazy. Municipalities determine policing NOT Police Services Boards. The Province needs to step in and deal with the dysfunctional policing situation in our Community. At minimum Councillors need training on who is responsible for what as far as policing in concerned.
Cobourg Taxpayers can NOT afford to have our own Private Police Force. Cobourg is growing. Our Police Force is growing and wants a new building, a gun range, and more.
That rumour about Police Response Time is just that – a rumour – spread, in part, by our own Private Police Force.
Everybody should read and/or listen to the presentation by Strategy Corp to Northumberland Council.
And I would not count on Lucas being a one time mayor. He seems to be the only one who cares that our Town is subject to the will of the County and is costing us all dearly.
I did not vote for Lucas but definitely will be next election. Very happy with most of his ideas thus far.
I did vote for him but will not again.
After 2 years of this Council accomplishing nothing for taxpayers, badgered by controversy, claims of a toxic workplace, legal troubles, staff turnover, massive tax increases, storm water taxation, significant increases in crime, drugs, homelessness and a dysfunctional relationship with the County, Cleveland is quite likely a one-term Mayor and may be feeling a little anxious to create a legacy – that could make him dangerous.
Who is asking for a Police merger? What group of vocal constituents are advocating for this? Should there be a referendum?
Why not fire the Chief and Deputy Chief?….Clean house. Maybe the biggest problem is in the administration of the CPS. Start there….Occam’s Razor.
Why the need to move to the most complex and expensive alternative first?
Very unlikely Lucas will be a one term mayor when the vast majority of the town including myself know he’s one of the only people advocating for the changes we desperately need in town.
A better question is why did the Police Board just renew the chiefs contract another 5 years?
And who allowed that new 5 year contract for the Chief??? Does the council. It have any input? Yes they do!
Like I previously stated, I didn’t vote for him (quite frankly I was worried he’d bow down to the likes of Missy and GWC) turns out that’s not the case. I’ll definitely be voting for him next time though. I think most people that want rid of the drugs in this town (about 90% of voters) know we definitely need Lucas. Turns out the County is the problem, the police chief, some other councillors, and a whole host of other bad actors. I truly believe Lucas has our best interest at hand.
Pete Fisher calling for a change to OPP for Cobourg
https://todaysnorthumberland.ca/2024/10/08/editorial-is-it-time-for-a-change-in-local-policing/
Pt Hope and Hamilton sre well advised to do their due diligence. Like a marriage a divorce in policing by municipalities can get very messy and expensive.
You covered it all very well the fact that we the Public are not being informed is concerning to say the least So the Big question is what purpose does this serve the Police Dept.
As you suggest this does not instil Confidence or let us know if the job is actually being done .
The other item I hear neighbours and citizens asking about is is the response time and how long it takes to reach the Local Police services after 5 P M
After listening to a lengthily recording your advised to call back and dial 911 an operator from outside the area takes the message and you wait This was never the case in the past .
The OPP already have all the resources at hand and Provencal support and it seems Cobourg & Port Hope call them in every time there is a difficult situation such as the recent case of a man falling into the Cobourg harbour .
The last thing I want to see is Cobourg / Port Hope trying to develop Swat teams , K 9 , and Scuba Teams Hiring more people to do the occasional job or building a new mega Police station for Millions . The OPP and the Province already have it .
This matter as Ben suggest has been beaten to death by nearly every Mayor Cobourg has had .
with no timely conclusion or improvement .
Moving to the OPP would provide a substandard level of community policing. Cobourg would lose control over wages and the service provided. When there is a need for officers in another region, the OPP will deploy officers from our area leaving us with minimal representation. Better to keep the OPP separate and call them in to assist our amalgamated police force when necessary.
You are absolutely right. As it stands now if we need extra assists they come if you are reliant on them for service and they are deployed to help others we would be left out in the cold. We have yet to hear from port hope. They are not over the hospital let’s see what they say about this
On the “Port Hope Politics” Facebook page this topic was posted under date of Oct. 1st. This is an open to public FB page.
In reading the 21 comments from Port Hope residents they oppose a Police Force merger and still are upset with the Hospital merger.
Carol – the amalgamation was brought up in the past year by the current mayor of Port Hope who was in favour.
Carol,
An amalgamated police service means if Port Hope has a major occurrence, officers on patrol in Cobourg will be shifted/ detailed to Port Hope to assist. This will mean the 3 or 4 officers on patrol in Cobourg will be down to 1 or 2 officers. And vice versa if the occurrence was in Cobourg.
Officers will be moved to where the need is in the County, no matter what model is chosen- OPP or Amalgamated CPS/PHPS.
So what is really needed is what is the cost to the taxpayer of Port Hope and Cobourg if they go Amalgamated or if they go OPP.
We have already Lost Control !!!
They only respond to the Mayor & Council when they feel like it
They don’t inform the public of what going on , on our streets until they feel like it and they want a Mega Million Dollar $$$
NEW Police station .
Wages will go up again on the basis of Parity with others now that the OPP salaries have been revealed .
And who is to say if the Service from the OPP will be less or inferior They Have an Office in town already and 1 on all side sof Cobourg so the idea that they won’t be available or galivanting around the country side is unfounded .
“After listening to a lengthily recording your advised to call back and dial 911 an operator from outside the area takes the message and you wait This was never the case in the past .”
Only after Cobourg made its own Dispatch redundant!
The OPP are majorly understaffed as it is which is a big issue with that argument. Also so much for the “community approach” when it comes to the OPP.
Its working for other communities
IE: Brighton , Warkworth Campbellford , Havelock, Bracebridge Huntsville , Bobcaygeon etc etc
and some of the issues we have no longer exist there .
What am I Missing ????????
Just to give everyone about how hard it is to get I touch with police. A neighbour who walks in the early Morning 5 to 7 am has banged on the police station twice now to report things he has seen during his walk and with all the police cars on the back lot no one answers the door. The other morning at 7 am 5 police cars were out front of Stacks and 3 behind the building. I wrote the mayor about why all the police cars are in the lot in the middle of the night and got a response from Police that they are doing paperwork. I can only think that when the bad guys come out after dark our police are not on the street but locked up in the station. I can never understand why police need new larger stations when the job is outside on the streets.
If you really want to know what I think read this: https://burdreport.ca/blog/2024/10/08/let-the-circus-begin/
Too big to be a comment but just another point of view
In conjunction with Mr. Cleveland’s motion, a condition should be incorporated that if a merger were to take place the Police Chief’s position would be subject to fresh applications for the role, with the best candidate being selected.
A new police force will only be effective if a qualified leader who has ability to manager a larger force and additional services suggested by Mr. Cleveland.
Now is the time to build this condition into the Oct 10th motion.
Rational,
I agree about ur comment on leadership, unfortunately I don’t see the Chief giving up the power and control he has consolidated since becoming Chief.
The other question is Pt Hope a willing bride in this Cobourg marriage proposal.
Remember this will only merge the urban area Ward 1 of Pt Hope. I doubt Ward 2 will relinquish the OPP for Cobourg.
With Hamilton Twp being approached I guess they wish to establish West Northumberland Police Service.
Is this a Cobourg Council driven initiative or Cobourg Police Service Board driven, under the guise of Council.
This will be interesting to see how it plays out as people and organizations jockey for position of who will be in charge.
Will it be a merger or a takeover???
In Robert Washburn’s Sept 28th Podcast Mr Cleveland spoke about a new plan to restructure the County (try 9 minute mark) and then moved on to why is Port Hope building on its West side rather than its East side, as If they built to the East a larger Urban Centre of Port Hope and Cobourg merging could happen.
Maybe the Police Services merger proposal is a first step in Empire being dreamed of, with Mr. Cleveland as Mayor. In support of this theory Mr. Cleveland did say on Sept 23rd, when introducing the Premier, that Cobourg was moving to be one of the largest Urban Centres east of the GTA.
Are too many ambitious concepts being introduced by Mr. Cleveland rather than staying in the Mayor of Cobourg’s lane. Let’s focus on managing us out of the mess Cobourg is in right now?
Imagine if Pt Hope and Hamilton Twp rebuffed Cobourg the same way Cobourg rebuffed the County on their policing proposal??
“ Port Hope building on its West side rather than its East side, “
Because Port Hope doesn’t have an East Side – it is called Hamilton Township!
Excellent point. So why is Lucas Cleveland running around throwing these type of ideas out? Seems foolish
In mayor cleveland’s mind boundaries are just lines on a map. I guess in his mind Pt Hope needs to be charging ahead and infilling those farm fields on the east side of Hamilton Rd?
“Cleveland did say on Sept 23rd, when introducing the Premier, that Cobourg was moving to be one of the largest Urban Centres east of the GTA.” Do you really think Lucas is responsible for this growth? Don’t be ridiculous! This PROVINCIAL growth plan has been on the books for years! These are not the ambitious concepts of one man.
Yes Cobourg is going to grow and is going to be another bedroom community for the GTA and with that no identity.
It was several years ago that Hamilton township contracted Cobourg police to provide their protection. We hired 8 police ?? to do the job and Hamilton dropped us after a year. We kept the 8 police as the police organization that controls police numbers in Ontario said Cobourg needed more police. I thought at the time that was very convenient. This is something Dean Pepper would know as far as details.
The contract was for 5 yrs from 2000 to 2005. i believe 4 officers stayed with Cobourg and 2 went OPP..
Heres are links to the story in northumberland news
https://www.northumberlandnews.com/news/switch-to-opp-smooth-for-hamilton-township/article_306c617c-143e-5610-b22a-eb63aba9ee98.html
https://www.northumberlandnews.com/news/township-says-opp-choice-about-control/article_ce175a23-2096-5dd9-9446-ef4fdd40f648.html
You will note from article that one of the reasons Hamilton Twp went OPP was to have more say on mattersand didnt want to have to foot bill for future infrastructure. Like paying for a new 34 million station without having a say in 2024…
I would caution all municipalities to do their due diligence if CPS comes calling offering policing services.
Will you have a voice or are you just a customer that will be dictated to.